Episode 98 - Winger - Winger (Part 2)

[00:00:05] Speaker A: This is our musical reaction, breakdown and commentary analysis of this song. Under fair use, we intend no copyright infringement, and this is not a replacement for listening to the artist's music. The content made available on this podcast is for educational and informational purposes only, notwithstanding a copyright owner's rights under the Copyright act. Section 107 of the Copyright act allows limited use of copyrighted material without requiring permission from the rights holders for purposes such as education, criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research. These so called fair uses are permitted even if the use of the work would otherwise be infringing. Now onto the Rock Roulette podcast. [00:01:14] Speaker B: Hey, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Rock Roulette podcast. That's right, the Crazy Ass podcast that took over 1200 albums, stuck them in a list, stuck them in a wheel. And typically, every other week, we spin the wheel. She picks a record for us, and we go through it side by side, track by track. We talk about the music, the production, and the lyrics, and we rate it just based on our own likes and dislikes. Again, just a bunch of friends who wanted to do a podcast. We love music. And again, we want to thank anybody who's listening, you know, thanks for sharing your time with us. Spread the word. If you like us, try and get us some more listeners. That's always great, but it's nice to know that we're not just talking to ourselves. So tonight we have Mark. Oh, hi, mark. [00:01:57] Speaker C: What's up, guys? [00:01:58] Speaker B: And I'm sad. [00:01:59] Speaker C: Ciao, Buenos Aires. [00:02:01] Speaker B: So last week, the wheel picked winger by winger, the debut album, which I guess anybody in this, who has listened to this type of music knows that it's a. It's a divisive album. I mean, it's. It's very infamous for. For what it represents and the fact that it was. Some people say that he, the steward from Beavis and butthead, by wearing the shirt, and him not being cool, took away from them, and people didn't appreciate it as much as they could have. So, I mean, I'm finding that musician wise, I mean, obviously, they're very good. And even though the songs are definitely fit within that genre, they definitely do some stuff that other bands weren't doing. They do a lot of different accents, a lot of stops and goes and things here and there. I'm not too crazy about the songs, though. And maybe the thing is, because of what they were writing and how good they were, maybe the second or third album could be a little bit, if they let loose a little bit, let's say, where, you know, we're not trying to make hits specifically, but, you know, we're spreading out a little bit. Maybe this stuff was a little bit better written. I don't know. What do you think so far, Mark? [00:03:17] Speaker C: Yeah, I tend to agree with that. I mean, I always knew, musician wise, they were better than the average band of that time. But, you know, unfortunately, you know, they kind of got caught up in, you know, I mean, you know, the lyrics are basically that time frame, right. That's what they did for lyrics. And that's kind of the way it was. They wrote very for the time lyrics. And, I mean, I don't think the songs are bad. I mean, obviously they all can play, he can sing, they're all good at their instruments, you know, again, like I said, probably better than the average of the timeframe. So, you know, I mean. I mean, I know a bunch of songs from this album. I think I even know some of the stuff coming up on the second side. I mean, haven't. Again, haven't listened to it, probably, since it was new. So take that into account. I. The names are very familiar. Whether I remember the songs are a whole nother thing. But, yeah, I mean, are there worse things out there? Of course. I'd be curious later on to get something like their third album, you know what I mean? With the one that came during that time frame where everything was changing. So, yeah, I. [00:04:19] Speaker B: Like I said, I bought that album. [00:04:22] Speaker C: Do you remember what it sounds like? [00:04:24] Speaker B: So, yeah, I don't. I only remember a couple of songs. I want to say the first song was good. It's a little bit heavier, and. But maybe the second song I remember as well, it was a little cheesy, but not too cheesy. It's kind of, like, playful. So I would say a little bit more in what this kind of genre, but I don't really remember the rest. And again, the reason I bought is because I saw Rod Morgenstein do a little clinic for free at a Sam ash. And, you know, he was really cool. And we were definitely impressed with his drumming. And again, because I really hadn't listened to them, again, it sticks out in your head when you go, okay, this guy's pretty good. So that's why I bought pull. So, I mean, I think Nick had definitely the first two cds for sure, because I remember seeing them. And then that one, I bought it in cassette. I don't remember what year it was, but I'm assuming early nineties. [00:05:25] Speaker C: Yeah. So I'm just curious to see maybe side two. I mean, there's one big song on side two, curious. The other stuff again. Mm hmm. Yeah, you're obviously gonna know that song, cuz it was everywhere, too. I mean, listen, they had moderate success, right? I don't think that they were gigantic, but they had. They were on MTV a lot. So, I mean, that. And this album went platinum. So, you know, so they were doing something right. It's just, you know, they have a little bit of different time signature. They have a little prog enos into their stuff. So, you know, that can either, like, make people like you or like. I don't know what this is, because it's just so different, you know? I mean, some of the riffs and stuff you listen to, you're like, well, that's not really what normal hair metal was about. You know what I mean? That's, you know, again, that's a testament to their musicianship. [00:06:11] Speaker B: So, yeah, I didn't pay attention enough to them to even realize that some of that stuff was going on. So, I mean, from that standpoint, I absolutely appreciate stuff like that, so. [00:06:21] Speaker C: All right, well, let's. Let's get into side two. [00:06:24] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:06:24] Speaker C: So this song is called state of emergency. Now, this name. I know, I've heard this just because the name sounds so familiar, but again, I haven't probably heard this in 35 years, so. A long time. All right, so here you go. Xylophone. Huh? Xylophone in the beginning of a song. That's interesting. [00:06:58] Speaker B: Yeah, well, I mean, they have the keyboard player. That's the thing too, right. There's a little bit more experimentation with some of the keyboard sounds, I think. [00:07:07] Speaker C: I guess it could be keyboards, right? [00:07:08] Speaker B: Purple haze. Yeah, I would think so. [00:07:10] Speaker C: Let's not talk about the beginning of purple haze. Let's not talk about purple haze. I don't really want to talk anything about purple haze on this. No, it's a sore spot for me. All right, here you go. [00:07:49] Speaker D: I never break down always seem to hurt someone until they try to run too late she breaking me down it's over when I see her face, you know I can't fight my way out I can sleep first time I gotta hold on real imagine. [00:08:29] Speaker C: So what do you think of that? [00:08:31] Speaker B: It sounds like four or five different parts of different songs that they kind of stuck together to me. [00:08:38] Speaker C: Yeah, it's very. It feels very aor again, to me. Maybe because the keyboard. [00:08:43] Speaker B: Yeah, I was gonna say that. Very aor. [00:08:46] Speaker C: Yeah. It's not as much, um. It's not as much Prague. I mean, I have to say, his guitar parts are very. They're not very straightforward. I mean, even when I was watching. I was watching some live stuff from recently I sent you this week and. Yeah, they were. They're still pretty good, though. So it's. It's pretty. It's pretty interesting to see them play because. No, nothing is really straight. Everything's pretty pretty. Like, not just straight chords and stuff. Like, he plays lots of philly things and lots of riffs and stuff, so I kind of appreciate that. I mean, this song's not really doing very much for me. It's kind of very. Eh. [00:09:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:09:21] Speaker C: I don't know if it's a good way to start side two. [00:09:24] Speaker B: Yeah. Later on, maybe. [00:09:30] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. More like the middle of the album. I mean, the middle of the side. Do you want to hear lyrics? Okay. Rough boy too tough to fall in love I never break down I always seem to hurt someone I turn, tried I turn and tried to run too late she's breaking me down it's over when I see her face, you know I can't find my way out emergency first time love's got a hold on me emergency a state of emergency now emergency. Does that sound like it's very foreigner ish? I don't know why I'm thinking foreigner when I hear that, but maybe I'm just reading into that. I don't know, thinking urgently, maybe. Maybe. You know, it's just very. I don't know. It's very light right now. Maybe it's the keyboard zoo in it, but it's very light. I don't know if I would have started again. I don't know if I would have started to side off with this. But let's see what they see, what they do. [00:10:26] Speaker B: I mean, that little intro piece is kind of, I guess, a good way. You know what I mean? Because it leads you, like, okay, it's got a little bit. I mean, the beginning riff, I kind of like, but I'm not crazy about the melody. And then the verse just comes out of nowhere. I feel. I'm not. The verse. [00:10:43] Speaker C: I'm sorry. [00:10:43] Speaker B: The chorus, like, the melody and the chorus shows a bit lazy. [00:10:50] Speaker C: Wow. Hey, listen, you know, I don't think. I think these lyrics are not as bad. They're trying to sell a story, I think. So maybe that. Maybe that'll help it out in the lyric department. So it's not as super, like, eighties cheese yet. So let's see. All right, let's go. [00:11:29] Speaker D: She breaking me down so when I see her face, you know, I can't find my way out. Imagine. Oh. [00:12:01] Speaker C: That riff sounds like something. Bump up bum bum bum bum. Like everything. [00:12:06] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:07] Speaker C: I mean, this really. That kind of riff really, like, places a song where it is. You know what I mean? [00:12:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:13] Speaker C: Like, if you heard this is not you. No doubt you'd know what decade this comes from. [00:12:18] Speaker B: Yeah, there's a rush. Bam, bam, bam, bam. [00:12:25] Speaker C: I wish I said the tip of my tongue. I know it's another song. [00:12:30] Speaker B: So before you read the lyrics. [00:12:32] Speaker C: Uh. Oh. [00:12:33] Speaker B: No, but I'm saying I'm. I try to follow along as well. And the website that I use always has little ads on the bottom. And usually the ads which run the whole time, no matter how many times I am out, it's always about up and coming artists. That's. That's what it is. It's a little blurb. I can see. But guess who popped a. Which band just popped up in the middle of all these blurbs that I've never seen pop up? [00:12:58] Speaker C: What band? [00:13:00] Speaker B: Foreigner. All of a sudden I'm getting ads about the Sticks foreigner tour. I'm like, I've never seen this. [00:13:11] Speaker C: It's weird. That's kind of strange. [00:13:13] Speaker B: Yeah, foreigner. He said farrier. Put foreigner. [00:13:16] Speaker C: Put foreigner. Heads up. The Internet's listening to you. [00:13:19] Speaker B: Exactly. The minions are like, oh, Stuart. Foreigner. [00:13:25] Speaker C: All right, so, I mean, there's not many more lyrics than this, so I'm just going to read this. This one section. It's pretty much the rest of the song. Pretty much. So. Shot down in the web of the modern girl you take your chances when the feel inside is real I turn and try to run too late she's breaking me down it's over when I see her face you know I can't find my way out then chorus again. I mean, that second part right there, which is technically listed as part of the verse. It's really not a verse. It's like a pre chorus because they did it before. So there's really four lines in this song that are different and everything's the same, so. Yeah, it's just very. It's very. [00:14:04] Speaker B: Hey, I mean, sometimes. I mean, honestly, a lot of this stuff is like words to be words. You know what I mean? It's like, well, we got music. We gotta. We gotta put some lyrics to it. [00:14:15] Speaker C: That could be too. It's very possible. [00:14:17] Speaker B: I mean. [00:14:19] Speaker C: I mean, it's a. It's a short song. It's only 337, so. Which maybe in this case, is good. Now, I'm hoping to have a good solo in here to redeem it for me. But I gotta. I gotta listen to the. I gotta listen. I haven't really listened to bass or. Or anything, really. So I gotta kind of listen that a little bit more, see how that's going. [00:14:39] Speaker B: But I haven't paid attention to bass. I think one song kind of mentioned something. [00:14:43] Speaker C: Yeah. I don't know. I mean, it's just a mix. It's possible. All right, let's listen. Here we go again. Quick for him. Very quick. I mean, it was good. It fit the song. [00:15:19] Speaker B: He's got a lot of space. Like, I mean, a lot of his stuff is, like, two bars and in and out. I mean, it's not even four bars, just boom, boom. Done. [00:15:27] Speaker C: Wouldn't you think that he would be, like, shredding all over the place just because, you know who he is, give. [00:15:31] Speaker B: Him a little bit. Right. Because that. I mean, you're gonna attract a whole other audience. [00:15:37] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:15:37] Speaker B: Right. You're gonna attract guitar players who want to hear more of it. [00:15:42] Speaker C: And I think maybe they thought it was. You know, this is. This is for the song. You mean, this is a. This is gonna be a radio thing. We're gonna put it out. Has to be short. Has to be whatever. I mean, 17 had a bunch of stuff on it, so, I mean, bunch of songs had a bunch of stuff. So 17 is probably the biggest. Has the most guitar playing. Probably. So. But, you know, that's because he wrote that song, so maybe that's why. Who knows? All right, so let's see where this thing goes. Well, anyway, that, um, he had some more playing there and stuff, but, I mean, it sounded weird at the end. I don't know. Was it just me just sounded. I don't know, something. It slowed down or something happened to it. I don't know. I didn't particularly like that too much. [00:17:26] Speaker B: I mean, he did the little thing, too. [00:17:31] Speaker C: I mean. I mean, the song on the first. [00:17:33] Speaker B: Side that did that, where it was, like, barely anything in the. In the middle, but at the end, you kind of got a pretty big outro solo. I think it was something else. [00:17:41] Speaker C: Without the night, maybe. [00:17:43] Speaker B: Oh, maybe. [00:17:44] Speaker C: Maybe. I mean, you know, he didn't really have a big, gigantic outro solo here, but he, you know, it wasn't bad. I mean, he's a good guitar player, and his vocals are good, the drums are good, but that. Man, that's such eighties drum production, man. That snare, that reverse gated reverse there. You got to really like that. I mean, it's the time, but it's just. I could see why it changed. And I could see why people wanted to go drier because it was just. So. [00:18:14] Speaker B: I'll take it over the. You know, the drum sound that I complain about on the show. I will take this sound over that sound anytime. [00:18:22] Speaker C: What sound is that? [00:18:23] Speaker B: Whatever. That compression where. Oh, you know what I mean? I was like, whatever they running it through where everything is, you know, full blown. And the drums just kind of get lost in the mix again, like we mentioned in McMars, Ace Fraley. [00:18:40] Speaker C: Oh, the new stuff. Oh, yeah, I. Yeah, new stuff's bad. No, because it's all samples, I think. I think they take a lot of stuff and replace it with samples of other stuff because they think it sounds better and it doesn't. All right, you want to go first? You want me to go first? [00:18:54] Speaker B: I want to go first. [00:18:55] Speaker C: All right, go ahead. [00:18:56] Speaker B: I mean, the lyrics really, there's nothing there. I say. I'll say a five on the lyrics because I think I gave lower to stuff that was probably worse than this. I mean, music, it's not played badly, but I mean, this song, to me is a. It's kind of a filler. And based on the fact that I think there's some decent parts, but there's. I don't feel like it's. It's cohesive. Like it kind of starts somewhere, then it goes somewhere into that pre chorus, then it goes. The chorus comes out of kind of nowhere. So I'll say five on the music again, not because it's played badly, but I. And production. Production was terrible. I mean, I don't know that we always throw bones to the. If we've been throwing bones, this production. So I'll say a seven. I mean, I think it was that bad. But like you said, eighties, but it was clear and you could pick up on stuff. So, I don't know, I didn't really connect with this one. What do you think? [00:19:59] Speaker C: Yeah, if you wanted to call a song filler, this is like the. The definition of filler. Like, I don't like the lyrics very much and there's not very many of them. Number one melody's not great. I say five on lyrics. Musicianship, you know, again, like you said, I'm not going to take away from their musicianship because I think it's good, but I think I need to give them a five because I think the parts are just very jammed together. And I got really weird at the end. Like, I didn't like the way it went. It didn't. It didn't really get pushed forward. Maybe I was expecting the drums to push it a little bit forward. It really didn't have just kind of, like, stayed there. And I just. I didn't like. I didn't like the ending at all. I mean, his guitar solo was fine. It was to the point it was two bars, really quick. In and out. Yeah. Which for if it's gonna be a single, that makes sense. A short song, right? I guess. I don't know. And then six on the production. I don't. I didn't really like it that much. I mean, everything was clear and all, but it was just. I don't know. There was just something about the song that does nothing, that just screams filler. We need a song. And again, not for the first song. I mean, this. It sounds really weak coming out of the gate. When you flip it over. Well, if you take it as, like, an album, right? If not, just. You're not just listening to it like, we're listening to it on, you know, Spotify or Amazon or whatever. We're listening to it on. When you flip it over. When you flip the vinyl over, this is the first one that comes on, you're like, ooh, this is not. This is not the song that I ever wanted anyway. [00:21:26] Speaker B: Well, think about this, right? You didn't like purple haze, right? So let's say you buy this on cd, you get purple haze. Then you get this, right? So you're not flipping this side over. You're going straight from that to this. So, like, two in a row. [00:21:43] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:21:43] Speaker B: I'm not liking this combo here. [00:21:46] Speaker C: All right, so the next one is time to surrender. I don't remember this at all. The name doesn't sound familiar to me. Assuming it's gonna be another mid tempo thing. I mean, it could be valid, but I think it's gonna be a mid tempo about four minutes, so it's not super long. So let's. Let's see if they have a little. Another little intro like that. You know, like they like to do on this stuff. So we'll see. [00:22:08] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:09] Speaker C: Here we go. That is very, very, very, very 1988. I mean, does it sound like them, or does this sound like eighties? I'm not too sure, because now I'm not sure if this is, like, the winger sound or is it just, like, 80 sound? I'm not sure. [00:22:52] Speaker B: Drums are weak, too. In this. I feel like it should be bigger. The ride should be bigger. And even that little thing he did on the toms, they sound like electronic Tom's, basically. I don't know. There's just I mean, it's a decent riff, I think. [00:23:05] Speaker C: Mm hmm. Yeah. But it's of the time, though. [00:23:07] Speaker B: I mean, listen, they're ultimately right. We talk about this a lot. There's. There's formulaic songs that a lot of bands did. And I think ultimately, what's. What makes it stick out is how the band writes it. Right. What they do to it to make it unique. That's. That's where. That's where what's really going to differentiate the song, so. [00:23:32] Speaker C: And they're playing how good they are makes it not be like everything else. Right? [00:23:36] Speaker B: Yeah. How they make it their own and how they. Even, again, even though it's kind of like, all right. I've heard this tempo. I've heard this progression. What are they going to do? Kind of to make it theirs or make it different? [00:23:48] Speaker C: Well, we're going to find out. Here we go. [00:24:04] Speaker D: But my heart is screaming hey you what you trying to prove? I won't play your game and I won't play your fool hey, you let me make it your move play your left hand better understand now it's time to surrender. [00:24:51] Speaker C: I don't know. I'm getting a little bit of a rat vibe there. Especially on this chorus, I think. I don't know. It's weird. I don't hate the chorus. The verse is. That verse part is weird. I don't like the melody there. That second part's okay. The hey, you part. Hey, you. That part's all right. [00:25:05] Speaker B: I mean, I think it kind of gets with that part. It sounds like them. Because then it reminds me of, like, hungry, right? It's like. [00:25:17] Speaker C: Yeah, no, I think now this sounds more like their style, I guess. I guess they do have a style. This is kind of their mid tempo style stuff, which they do. But I think I do remember the song. When the chorus came, I'm like, I think I remember this. Do you remember this at all? [00:25:32] Speaker B: No, I don't remember the other one either. The other one before. [00:25:36] Speaker C: Yeah, I think I remember the chorus a little bit. I mean, again, it's not something that I listen to, so it's very. Could just be Nick might have played it. Maybe he might have been playing in the car, possibly. And I heard then, because I don't think I own this. [00:25:48] Speaker B: So, I mean, I. Yeah, I've never owned it. I've listened to it, though, because, again, I borrowed it from him. So I've listened to the whole album, but I just don't remember anything so far. I don't remember either one of these two songs so far. [00:26:05] Speaker C: All right, I want to lead you lyrics. Here we go. I'm out the back door just before midnight I push the pedal to the floor, I run away she says it's only in my head but my heart is screaming hey you what you're, what you're trying to prove. I won't play your game and I won't play your fool. Hey, you best be making your move play your last hand better understand now it's time to surrender yeah, yeah cuz my love don't live her anymore ooh, babe, time to surrender there's nothing left to fight for there's nothing left to save. So, is this about, like, a relationship that's going bad? Maybe he's trying to get away. That the verse is a weird. I don't really like the melody there. I mean, I guess that second part of the verse is trying to lead into the hey, you thing. So that's interesting that he's doing that. But, you know, to me, you know, it's a. It's a mid tempo, mid tempo song, and I don't know if you count this as more filler. It's very, very possible. [00:27:09] Speaker B: I think it's better than the one before so far, though. I mean, I will give it that. [00:27:13] Speaker C: Yeah, I think I like it better. [00:27:14] Speaker B: It's more interesting, and I think the melody is better, and it's more cohesive. [00:27:20] Speaker C: Yeah. It feels like it's one song and not just jammed together. [00:27:22] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:24] Speaker C: All right, let's see how it continues. Here we go. I backed it up a little bit. [00:27:46] Speaker D: Hey, you watch it. Trying to prove I won't play your game and I won't play your cool hey, you just been making your cool play your left hand better understand now it's time to surrender yeah, yeah. Cause my love don't live here anymore time to surrender it's not love you're making, it's my heart. [00:28:43] Speaker C: I think I even disliked that second verse more than the first one. [00:28:47] Speaker B: Yeah, they kind of jammed in that little heartbreaker. Right? It was like. And even this part. This part where they left off on sounds like a different song. It's almost, like, zeppeliny kind of. It reminds me of. [00:29:01] Speaker C: But I was gonna say that. [00:29:03] Speaker B: Yeah. Because I was thinking, like, this reminds you of something. Mm hmm. But it sounds like it's in a different key that doesn't belong there. [00:29:12] Speaker C: Yeah. I think the hey you part is my favorite part of that. Hey, you in the chorus is not bad. Both of those parts are okay. The verses, I don't like. [00:29:25] Speaker B: Using. Yes. As fillers. [00:29:27] Speaker C: Yeah, of course. Well, it's funny, when you see on the pa. On the. On the lyrics, too, you have to read it. Yeah, it's even worse. Okay, so. Oh, she cries so tough it's too hard to let go of the lies inside the shadow of her tears and her pain and he read. And he sang that line weird, too. [00:29:45] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:47] Speaker C: And I denied when she was playing the heartbreaker. And then back to the hey, you. And then back to surrender again. That's no different. I'm not a big fan of the verse of any kind, and I don't hate the little. I'm gonna back it up a little bit. I don't hate the riff right before this, you know, before the solo. I like when they change and put a little riff there that's maybe not in the rest of the song, but I can understand how people would think that's really jammed in together. All right, let's see. Let's see if he gets more than two bars here. Here we go. [00:30:42] Speaker D: No, no, I can't. [00:30:45] Speaker C: I mean, even that was kind of. So that was kind of short. Yeah, but if it felt like he was trying to get some stuff in, it felt like it needed a little bit more time. Just a little bit. Yeah. [00:30:55] Speaker B: I mean, give him some space, especially in a song like this, where. I mean, and this doesn't sound like. I mean, I don't know if it was released as a single, but, I mean, really doesn't have a lot of breathing room when it comes. I mean, especially considering, like, what a name he had, right? [00:31:10] Speaker C: Mm hmm. [00:31:11] Speaker B: I mean, you got CCTV sand. It's two years later, and it's their third album, but he's doing, like, eight bar, ten bar solos. Meanwhile, this poor guy who's considered, like, you know, a really good guitar player from gets, like, nothing except for the one song. [00:31:30] Speaker C: I mean. I mean, this here is, you know. I mean, he's trying to get. Trying to work something out. I don't think it feels like it wasn't totally, like it needed a little. [00:31:39] Speaker B: Yeah, you didn't get to flush it out. I mean, I liked what you played so far. [00:31:43] Speaker C: Yeah, no, it's good. Yeah. I don't know. All right, let me back it up a little bit, and then we'll go to the next part that's coming up, because that's one of the few different things that are happening. So here we go. [00:32:03] Speaker D: Night after night. Just pretend. Oh, no, it's closer to the end. My body says go, but I know that now it's time to surrender? Yeah, yeah. Cause I know don't live here anymore? Surrender? It's my love you're making? It's my heart you're breaking? Surrender? [00:33:16] Speaker C: You like to end? [00:33:18] Speaker B: Yeah. I was waiting for the double time to come in that dude. [00:33:22] Speaker C: Yeah, well, they will. You know, they didn't really do that, so. That's okay. I'm gonna read the one last part here. Oh, no, I can't take this again. Nia. Tonight just pretending. Oh, no, it's closer to the end. My body says go, but I know that. And then chorus. That actually part was okay. I was. I didn't hate that. I like how it led into the chorus, but I guess it's just like. Is it the same thing as the. Hey, you. Yeah, pretty much. Right. That's probably why I like it. Um hmm. Thanks. I think I like the lyrics better in this than the other one, so I'm gonna say six on the lyrics least. There's a little story involved about a relationship going bad. He. He knows you should leave, but he's not going to. I mean, I think the musicianship is good. I mean, he has some interesting guitar parts, like little fills and things here. But, you know, again, I think it's kind of short for him, you know, being guitar player, I would like to be a little bit longer. I don't. I mean, listen, there's a time and a place where a short solo needs to be there and to the point. And then there are other songs, like, he should have a little bit more, because this is definitely not a single, so. Hmm. I gave five on the other one. I'm gonna give this one a six, and I think the production is better on this one. I give that a six, so I'll probably give it a seven. I mean, I expect. You know, I think Rob Morgenstein. Wasn't he in the Dixie dregs or something? He was in some other stuff. Some other stuff, right. That's for Steve Morse. Yeah. So they're. They've been regarded as really good musicians, too, so I. I was expecting a little bit more in the drum side. I just. I feel it's very. It's played very safe, at least this song. Anyway. Um. I don't know. I mean, again, not my most favorite, but, I mean, it's better than the last one. They should have started with time of surrender. Time to surrender. Or maybe the next one. I don't know what the next one's gonna sound like, but state of emergency definitely shouldn't have been the lead off. [00:35:17] Speaker B: No. [00:35:19] Speaker C: All right. What do you think? [00:35:20] Speaker B: Maybe only because it had that little keyboard part at the beginning, or they added the keyboard part because they wanted. [00:35:25] Speaker C: To put it first, you know, so maybe no. [00:35:29] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, lyrics aren't gonna say a five again. I guess they're better than the last one, but it's still within that. It's like, I gotta write something, so I'm just gonna write this. So, I mean, anytime you can rhyme, make it and break it. Music. I'll say it. Six. I do think the music is better in this one than it was in the last one. And see, production. I'm gonna say six. It wasn't terrible, but I just. I felt like I needed a bigger production. So at least on the drums, I think that's really. That was, like, my thing. I don't. I don't necessarily think, like, the guitar was bad. I just. I want to. Bigger on the drums. I think it could have. Would have helped the song a little bit more. I was gonna say that it's not bad, but again, I don't know that I would really go back to. Well, I don't know what I would. I'm gonna be. Other than the one that I said I liked the first time. I don't know what I would go back to this one on so far. [00:36:26] Speaker C: I mean, I think the first side has three. Three good songs on it. Even. Even though the hungry is good. [00:36:34] Speaker B: I mean, like I said, 17. I was never the thing. [00:36:39] Speaker C: I mean, I try to differentiate the the music and the, and the sentiment of the lyrics and just taking the time frame, but, I mean, general. [00:36:46] Speaker B: I mean, it just wasn't a. A big, you know, I mean, like, even back then. I mean, back then, I wasn't thinking about anything. [00:36:53] Speaker C: Yeah, but, okay. [00:36:56] Speaker B: I mean, without the night, it's still my favorite so far. [00:36:59] Speaker C: I agree. I think it's one of my favorites on this. Um. All right, so next one's called poison angel. I don't know if I remember this. I'm assuming this is not going to be. This is gonna be another mid tempo thing. [00:37:10] Speaker B: 324 remember this title for some reason. [00:37:14] Speaker C: Yeah, me too. [00:37:15] Speaker B: I don't remember the song. [00:37:17] Speaker C: You're gonna find that right now. [00:37:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:37:19] Speaker C: Let's see you go. [00:37:20] Speaker D: Poison Angela so many years I don't know where my fear I have to be the way you look tonight we met gets me hot breathing, don't sweat. You were so shy AI, that was so high AI, that I don't remember the rest. But the one thing that I'll never forget here. Trying to take my wings away. [00:38:28] Speaker C: Get. [00:38:29] Speaker D: Down on your knees. [00:38:35] Speaker C: So what are you thinking about that? [00:38:38] Speaker B: I think that this is probably the most generic. Yeah. Like, this is really, really, really something that really could have been written by anybody else. You know what I mean? They don't have any odd time. They don't have whatever. I mean, the words, the melody. [00:39:01] Speaker C: Well, he got a little. He got a little guitar playing at the beginning. I don't know if that's going to translate. [00:39:05] Speaker B: Yeah, but even that, but even that, though, right? He does that whole whammy bar, we think. And I'm like, oh, dude, really? [00:39:13] Speaker C: No, I mean, it has to be a little. [00:39:15] Speaker B: And again, take it as a compliment. Right. I just think it's. [00:39:19] Speaker C: They have more to give you. [00:39:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:39:23] Speaker C: Well, I'm going to read the words, and you're probably going to rate these lower than the one before. [00:39:27] Speaker B: Mm hmm. [00:39:29] Speaker C: I know that you know that I've seen your face before a bad dream, so mean rocking me down like a slot machine so many years I don't know when. My dear how have you been? The way you look the night we met gets me hot breathing, oh, cold sweat. You were so shy and I was so high that I don't remember the rest. But the one thing I'll never forget. You're a poison angel trying to take my wings away. Poison angel, get down on your knees and pray. It's very. [00:39:57] Speaker B: So he has wings, too. [00:40:00] Speaker C: I guess. I guess they're both angels. Because she's the poison angel. He's just regular. Regular angel. [00:40:06] Speaker B: I guess he's the antidote angel, maybe. [00:40:10] Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, and, you know, the drums are very. It's not. There's let. This is more of straightforward. Like, anyone could have wrote this. This doesn't have. Unless there's gonna be some change in the middle somewhere that I don't know about. So I'm curious to see what it continues. I mean, it's a short song, so let's continue. [00:40:28] Speaker D: Remember what you said? You sent a letter, I read twice I found out it was all nice but there you were looking so cool. Let me in my dream laughing while you watch me sing. You are so shy I was so high AI that I don't remember the rest. But the one thing that I'll never forget. [00:41:28] Speaker C: All right, you know the part in the chorus? I actually like the little guitar part in the chorus. That's more of them than the rest of the song is. Yeah. Yeah. I like the guitar part in the chorus. I think it's a little bit more than maybe someone else would have done, but, I mean, basically, the song is pretty stock for the time, so I'm gonna read your lyrics again. I still remember what you said. The part about me dropping dead. You sent a letter. I read it twice. I found out that you weren't so nice? But there you were looking so cool to this country boy in the New York groove? So he left me in the drink laughing while you watch me sink I need. I need to read this part again because I didn't read it correctly last time. You were so shy yi yi and I'm so high aye, aye. And then. Really? So. I don't know. It's very. It doesn't. It doesn't match to what I think as far as the rest of the record does. It's starting to. Is starting to fall apart. But, I mean, I think the last song on this thing is probably gonna be one of the best on the side. I mean, that doesn't take very much. Yeah. So now we're gonna do solo, and I'm assuming. I'm assuming there's gonna be more in this. I don't know. I'm wrong every time I miss a short song. So how much more can there be? So I don't know. Here we go. Cross your fingers, get down on your knees and pray. Well, I have to say that feels more composed. It feels like he knew exactly where he was going and what he was going to do. So it sounded. Even though it was short, it sounded a little more. A little more to the point. So I don't hate it as much, even though it is short. [00:43:41] Speaker B: Again, I just felt it was very generic. [00:43:43] Speaker C: What is generic to me? [00:43:45] Speaker B: You know, when you kind of talk about the end of this erade, right. This is kind of like what I would, in my head, like, if I say, okay, you mean a song like this? Like, this is something that I would put on when you talk about stuff like this. And again, not. And not that. Oh, okay. This is. This is what came at the end of the year. I mean, this stuff was already going on. And listen, there's bands that are gonna come up where I'm like, even, like, let's say, warren. Where Warren has some stuff like this, too, where it just sounds, like, very stock and very generic. And it's like, well, you know, we kind of need a song like this. Or like, that's what this feels like. Very. We need a song like this. [00:44:32] Speaker C: I mean, listen, I can pick apart the guitar solo and say, hey, you know, it's fast. Just for the sake of fat. See, to me, this is a little bit different than the Cici DeVille flurry and note things. It's much different because he's a different guitar player. It feels more. When he does it, it feels more accomplished. Does that make sense? Is it weird, weird to say that? [00:44:50] Speaker B: Yeah. I understand. [00:44:52] Speaker C: His fast passages are different than the fast passages of Cece Deville. It's just different. It feels different. You know, again, I'm not taking anything away from anyone's musicianship, but, you know, the song. I mean, the songs aren't as good, and that's really what it comes down to. That's why they're on the second side. I mean, that's really what I mean, as far as I can tell. Right? [00:45:13] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. I mean, definitely the stuff on the first side is so far, seems better. [00:45:20] Speaker C: I mean, even a song like 17, which you don't like, you have to admit, it's better than songs on the side. [00:45:24] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I agree. I mean, it's more interesting. I mean, again, even in a song that's very generic lyrically. And again, they could have been about any subject, they're still not playing it straightforward. No, they're doing stuff where I. Like I said, I never really paid attention to what was going on, so I gave him credit for that. [00:45:44] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:45:45] Speaker B: And this one. [00:45:49] Speaker C: It'S. It's hard to make a case that this is a good song to me. I mean. I mean, is it horrible? Is it horrible? No, no, it's not like. Oh, my. Yeah, it's not like, played badly again. But the drums aren't very interesting in this at all. Very straight. [00:46:06] Speaker B: But I think they sound better. I'll be. I'll say that I do think the drums sound better in this song than they do. I mean, I hate to think the ride is better, for sure. So I. If I can say one thing, I'll say that I agree. [00:46:20] Speaker C: Okay. All right, let's finish it up. Here we go. [00:46:28] Speaker D: Always try to take my wing away down. [00:47:09] Speaker C: Even the end is very stock. A little riff at the end, and, I mean, at least he got a little bit of guitar playing at the end. [00:47:14] Speaker B: I mean, you know, it's. Then by his voice, I think that, you know, for what it's worth, he had a unique force, of course. [00:47:21] Speaker C: Yeah. I mean, but this. This is almost the accentuation of. And again, not taking anything away from his guitar player, because he's a great guitar player. But it's very. In songs like this, this is where, oh, Eddie Van Halen plays like that. I'm gonna play like this. You know what I mean? Like, he does that kind of. This is the stuff that I feel that's very. That they. That, you know, people take one part of his playing and try to do it, you know what I mean? And say, this is all that there really is, and it's really not the case. I mean, again, he's a really good guitar player, so I know he plays better than this. Obviously, the songs on the first side that are way better. And I watched, you know, some live stuff, even recently, and some older stuff. I mean, you know, he's great. You know, he's. He's a great guitar player. You know, when he does the things that. That make him stand out, like the tapping, where he does tapping and the things that. You know what I mean? In this thing, it's just fast for. Fast. And, yes, it's impressive that it's so clean and fast like that, because obviously, you know, you have to have some kind of talent to do that. But again, that was the style. And you're right. This. This does. You can almost feel, like, this stuff on, like, warrant and things of this timeframe that's very similar to this. This is not a standout as far as winger goes. And they're off time. Little Prague adding things to it. Right. That's what I think. So. Well, you can go first on this one. [00:48:40] Speaker B: I'm gonna say a four on the lyrics. Music. You know what? I'm gonna throw another bone in the production because I like the way the drums sound, and I didn't like the way they sounded before. So I'm gonna say seven on the. On the production, because I think for what it is, it's produced really well. Music. I'll say five, I guess. I mean, again, I feel like I've heard this song from other bands. And again, a lot of the bands wear a. People would buy cds, and it would be like, one and done. I'm like, okay, so, yeah, there's no. I think there's nothing here that makes them. The uniqueness of what they were. From what I've heard so far, there's none of that here. And again, not that every song has to be like, because I think I mentioned it, too, in the last podcast. Sometimes I think they do it so much that it does detract from the song a bit. But, I mean, this one is, you know, it's like a program, basically. Click button one, button two, button three, and then you got this song trying to. Thank you. So, what do you think? [00:49:41] Speaker C: Yeah, I kind of agree. Um, I'm gonna say five on the lyrics. I mean, so I. I mean, I gave six on the last one, so this is definitely worse than that one. So I'm gonna give it a five, I think. Not that the musicianship is bad, because I don't think any of us can say. Either of us say that the musicianship technically is bad, but since we don't have a. Since we don't have a thing for, you know, I don't know what we would call it. Composition. We need a composition score that would help us out, you know, is very generic, and, you know, his playing, albeit very clean and very accomplished, does nothing for me. I think the other stuff he's done before is more interesting, and again, it's not to slag on them. I mean, after hearing the other stuff on the first side you had, your bar is set a little higher. Right. So when the bar is not really met that way, you feel a little cheated that, you know, it could be better. But it's not like if this came on the radio, like, I would be. I'd be switching through this. I would have switched channels already. Yeah. I'm gonna give the same thing for production seven, because I think that you're right. I think I like the drums a better sound. The sound of the drums better on this than the other one, or very. Or close, anyway. So I'm gonna give that a seven. I mean, this side is going through very quickly. It's not this. I mean. All right, so the next one is hanging on. I don't know if I remember this at all. Do you remember this at all? [00:51:12] Speaker B: No. I want to say, from the last one, though, I remember him saying poison angel. I want to say I could be wrong, but when he said that, I'm like, I may remember this. [00:51:24] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, now, are we saying this is ballady, or are we saying this is more mid tempo, maybe mid tempo. Right. [00:51:31] Speaker B: Because the big ballads kind of coming, so. [00:51:33] Speaker C: Yeah. Which is a weird place for the ballad. [00:51:37] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:51:38] Speaker C: Last track. [00:51:38] Speaker B: I mean, in this time. [00:51:39] Speaker C: Yes, yes. That would have happened already. Right. [00:51:43] Speaker B: And the first side, I mean, I think if anything, they would have switched the mid tempo ballad on the first one. [00:51:49] Speaker C: And maybe, I don't know, maybe they just want. [00:51:53] Speaker B: Again, maybe they're like this. They just don't want to be like, we're trying to set us apart a little. [00:51:59] Speaker C: Well, someone sequenced it the way they wanted to sequence it, so. [00:52:02] Speaker B: Yeah, exactly. [00:52:03] Speaker C: All right, so here we go hanging on. So do you think that's more what you expect from them? [00:52:33] Speaker B: I think it's more from what I expect from rap. I mean, this song is just straight up rap except for that beginning. What riff is that? [00:52:40] Speaker C: What do you mean? [00:52:41] Speaker B: That riff is something. I mean, that is, like, blatantly something else. I can't think of it. But once it gets into the guitar line thing. [00:52:50] Speaker C: Yeah, or the dent. Dent. Dent. That part. [00:52:52] Speaker B: Yeah, that part. [00:52:53] Speaker C: The very beginning here in hearing comes the problem. It's, you know, again, Van Halen effect. That would be something you would hear him. [00:53:02] Speaker B: Exactly. But once they get into the verse that is straight up ratified. And again, it's Bo hill. [00:53:10] Speaker C: Yeah. No, I mean, again, like I said, I don't blame Red beach. You know, it's the time. Everyone's trying to be the next Eddie Van Halen, you know what I mean? He's kind of the blueprint. Everyone's trying to take his stuff and showing they can play faster than him. I can play cleaner than him, I can tap like him, I can use the whammy bar. But again, I think they're all taking the wrong parts from him. Taking the wrong parts. The things that you're doing are the things that are easy to do and not the hard stuff. The hard stuff is things that you can't do. Phrasing, swing, things that you can't really. You're taking the parts. Oh, whoa. If I just use my whammy bar like this or tap like this, you know what I mean? Like, the part that you can't really take is the part that they can't do, which sets him apart from these, from this. So, I mean, we haven't had a lot of Van Halen on this podcast. So, you know, we had one album, so I'm hoping to get another one to kind of, like, showcase that kind of stuff. No. No matter what era it's from, whether it's from Sammy Hager era or David Lee Roth or, God forbid, Garrett, your own era, that's the one I'm waiting for. But even on that, I'm not going to tip my hand about that. But even on the stuff there, I don't particularly like that album very much. I think it's poorly produced, and it was. Eddie Van Halen just left his own devices. There are still parts of it that can catch. Oh, okay. This is why he's good. You know what I mean? Even though on there, there are parts that are still good there, but it's very few and far between for me. I know other people have different opinions anyway, but. So. Yeah, so that little think ting thing. Yeah. And I can hear the rat. It's a little ratty. I thought I heard that before, too. [00:54:46] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I've heard it. I've heard it before, too. But I gotta meet tribute. That's Bo Hill. [00:54:49] Speaker C: I don't think the Bo hill do rat, too. [00:54:52] Speaker B: I'm pretty sure you did. Yeah. I mean, I know for sure he did. What do you call it? Which I had. Which actually kind of like, reach for this guy. That's all we call junior on it. [00:55:03] Speaker C: Yeah. I like that song. [00:55:05] Speaker B: I think he was their producer. [00:55:07] Speaker C: You look it up. Let's continue with this while that's going on. [00:55:27] Speaker D: Last time to walk away last time if you think of saving yourself don't say all my love was in vain and don't say I'm a stranger again it's just not fair that I can't do anymore I still want you I still need you can't let go oh, I can't keep from hanging on can't stop doing nothing I can't keep from hanging on hanging on. [00:56:10] Speaker C: Now, one thing I gotta say in that chorus that's. That's very typical, the way they do background vocals and stuff. So I do like that. You know what I mean? So I. I think that is very them. The chorus is very them. The way. The way the vocals happen and stuff, which kind of, I guess, sets them apart a little bit. But I do hear the parts in the middle. I mean, it's. It's a very rat, very wannabe sunset strip. [00:56:34] Speaker B: Yeah, but, I mean, isn't that riffe. I mean, what do you call it? I mean, even the melody is, um. What's wrong with that? Something. It's, um. I don't want to. [00:56:48] Speaker C: Well, I'll read your lyrics. Maybe it'll come back. [00:56:51] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:56:52] Speaker C: My love, try to understand me I can't stop thinking about you the howling down inside is crying out for your touch last time you walk away last time if you think you're saving yourself don't say all your love was in vain and don't say I'm a stranger again it's just not fair that I can't see you anymore I still want you I still need you I can't let go I can't keep from hanging on I can't stop no, I'm not that strong I can't keep from hanging on hanging on I don't hate the chorus, actually. I think I like the chorus. I like the background vocals there, but I can hear. This is very. Yeah, it does sound like other stuff. I mean, there are parts of it that sound like winger, I guess. I mean, his guitar playing is a little. I mean, I hesitate to say, because I keep saying Van Halen. I mean, but there are parts of that. That in there that. [00:57:41] Speaker B: Oh, absolutely. I mean, is it unchained that I'm thinking of? I mean, it just. It feels like it. [00:57:48] Speaker C: I don't know. It's just he did a lot of that arpeggio chord things. Like, his stuff was very rarely just chords played, so maybe that's why it sounds that way again. But obviously they're taking it from that. I mean, you know, again, not. Not diminishing his guitar playing prowess at all. Yeah, but, yeah, this is still. This is a very wanna be something else. And, I mean, his vocals do set it apart. His vocals are very good. I mean, I'm sure he has a hard time singing this now. [00:58:20] Speaker B: Yeah, he's got. I mean, it's got a strong voice. [00:58:22] Speaker C: I mean, some of the stuff that I sent you. He's having a hard time singing it. Right? Some of the stuff, yeah. [00:58:26] Speaker B: But not overly hard. Right? I mean, he wasn't like, oh, my God, no. You know, I mean, give. I give him credit for that. [00:58:33] Speaker C: I think it may be in the same key, too. I'm not sure, but it may be. All right, let's continue. [00:58:50] Speaker D: Believe I still hope you chose my soul again and again I still want you I still need you I can't let go I can't stop, no, I'm not that strong can't keep from hang it up hang it up all right. [00:59:20] Speaker C: Before the solo happens, I'll read lyrics. I know yesterday's over but in here the flame is burning on burning a hole in my heart where I still believe I'm still hoping you close the door again and again I still want you I still need you I can't let go, no and then back to the chorus. I mean. I mean, it's obviously very eighties, right? But again, I do like the chorus. I think it's catchy. [00:59:48] Speaker B: I like the pre chorus. [00:59:50] Speaker C: What? You close the door again and again. That one. I still want you I still need. [00:59:54] Speaker B: You yeah, kind of like that. Yeah, I think. [00:59:56] Speaker C: I mean, the core, the verse and the pre chorus feel a little jammed together a little bit. It's not as smooth as I would like that, I don't think. [01:00:05] Speaker B: I just feel like. Again, he's playing that bam, bam, bam. Like me. Like, if you brought this riff to me and be like, no, you know what you're playing, right? Like, that's what I would say. I would absolutely say, you know what you're playing, right? You're playing unchained to me. That's what it sounds like. [01:00:25] Speaker C: Yeah. I don't hear that, though. I mean, I have. Maybe I have to listen a little deeper, baby. I may not pay attention to it. [01:00:30] Speaker B: I mean, I think maybe because his melody is different. I don't know. I mean, that's what I'm hearing. [01:00:35] Speaker C: Hmm. [01:00:37] Speaker B: Just in the verse, though, because I think they get away from it once he goes into the. The pre chorus and the chorus. [01:00:43] Speaker C: Yeah, it does change. Like I'm saying, there's a little bit of a thing there with. It's a little drawing when it changes. Well, I'm curious. I mean, this is. This is another 335. I don't know how much longer his solo could be, but we're gonna find out. Yeah, here we go. That's a weird part. We're gonna have to back that up. [01:01:20] Speaker B: I know. [01:01:23] Speaker C: I actually thought that solo was pretty good. [01:01:25] Speaker B: It wasn't bad. [01:01:26] Speaker C: I actually thought that bars that he had the. I guess there's four bars there, that it was good. It was very composed, because I was. [01:01:31] Speaker B: Thinking, too, should it go more? I'm like, nah, but that was enough. [01:01:34] Speaker C: No, for this one was. I think that was the right length. The right length. [01:01:38] Speaker B: I agree. [01:01:38] Speaker C: I mean, you know, it had. It had all the elements of the time, right? Whammy bar, horsey noise, you know, fast playing. You know, it's. Of the time. [01:01:48] Speaker B: Is that what they call it? [01:01:52] Speaker C: That's what he called. That's what he called it. Sounds like a horse. [01:01:55] Speaker B: I never thought about that. Yeah. [01:01:57] Speaker C: I mean, not exactly, but, I mean, anytime you use to. [01:02:01] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, that sounds like a good description to me. Yeah. [01:02:05] Speaker C: So, you know, there's a weird bass thing coming up over here. I'm gonna back this up a little bit. [01:02:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:02:11] Speaker C: I want to see what this is. Here we go. [01:02:34] Speaker D: I can't keep from hanging out I can't stop no, I'm not back I can't keep from hanging on hanging off hang it all I can stop no, nothing from hanging out hang it up. [01:03:33] Speaker C: I can hear now. I'm starting to hear what you're saying. It's so van Halen. It wants to be that little part. [01:03:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:03:40] Speaker C: You know what? I was also just thinking about this now as I was going on. The reason why I just came to me just, like, listening to this and just trying to listen to that part. The reason why the Van Halen stuff is okay, because in general, it was played one take, most of the stuff, not everything. Later on, he started to overdub and stuff. But think about it. Like, he played one take through the thing, and him and his brother had such, like, that brother thing going on that it was. That's maybe why it made it better. That's the only thing I can think of. Because here, you know, you can hear, like, the improvise. Like, he overdubbed all those pieces. And sometimes it doesn't sound as organic because of that. I think if you do it enough, you start to lose that. Especially the more times you have to do it, the worse it gets. So, yeah, I could see. I could definitely hear that. I know exactly what you're trying to say about why that sounds that way. [01:04:30] Speaker B: Did you like the ending? [01:04:31] Speaker C: I liked the drums. The drums were great. I liked. I liked all the stuff going on. [01:04:35] Speaker B: A little sloppy to me drum wise. Yeah, like, that part was like. [01:04:43] Speaker C: Yeah, you think? I don't know. I kind of, like. [01:04:45] Speaker B: I can't own up on him. It just. It just felt like, I mean, a little soppy. [01:04:49] Speaker C: So did you go first before, or did I go first? [01:04:52] Speaker B: I don't know. I don't remember. [01:04:53] Speaker C: I'll go first, I guess. I don't know. I mean, I think the lyrics are better than the last song. I think they're better. I like the chorus a lot, so I'm gonna give it a six. Musicianship. I mean, guitar solo was good. I mean, there's some blatant. You know, we need to try to copy certain things because this is the way this thing sound these days. You know what I mean? So I'm kind of like. I don't know what I give this. I'll probably give it a six. And do I do I do triple six? Do I do triple six? Yes, I'm gonna do triple six. So triple six, six in the production, too. The first triple six we've given it, it's not. Triple seven was triple six. Number of the beast. All right, go ahead. [01:05:31] Speaker B: Um. I'll say a five on the lyrics, and then I think I'm gonna say probably a six on the music and a six on the production. I mean, I do think it's better than the first two songs. I don't know if it's better or whichever. I kind of lost myself at this point where. With where we are in terms of the number of songs. [01:05:51] Speaker C: So let's see. See? One, two. Oh, on this side, it's better than. [01:05:55] Speaker B: The first one and the poison angel, but state of emergency, I think, might be a better song overall. But this is better than the other two. [01:06:05] Speaker C: They're all averaging out to the same score, pretty much. Which is six. Pretty much. It's six. It's middle of the road. It's whatever. It's like if you like, you keep it on. If not, you change it. Pretty much comes down to now, I'm assuming we're going to like the next song much better. Obviously it was a single. [01:06:19] Speaker B: Don't. Don't guarantee because I've never liked this song either. [01:06:22] Speaker C: Oh, really? [01:06:22] Speaker B: But it's been a while. Honestly, it's been a while since I've heard this song. So this is gonna be a. This is definitely gonna be a fresh take on this song. So I'm actually looking forward to. Because I wasn't crazy about it back then as a ballad. I mean, I just thought that there were better ballads out there. You know what I mean? Hair metal ballads back then. [01:06:40] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:06:41] Speaker B: So. But it's like I said, it's been a long time since. Since I've heard this one. [01:06:45] Speaker C: So I think comparatively to what's on the side, it's going to be the best. It's going to be the best song. [01:06:50] Speaker B: Yeah, it absolutely could be. So I'm going to keep my mind open for sure. [01:06:54] Speaker C: So. Us mainstream rock eight us billboard top Billboard Hot 119. So it's top 20 song. It was the b side. The b side to the single was state of emergency. So this was. This was an actual single release. So I think. I think you're gonna like some of the drum stuff. I think you're gonna like some of the keyboard stuff. It's just. It's a little different than you remember, I think. I think it's gonna be more in the vein of the beginning part of the album. Technically, they should probably take mine open for sure. They should have taken head of a header for a heartbreak, put it on the first side in place of purple haze and put purple haze at the end. Really? Technically. Then you would have one good one. Decent side, right? Really fully function, decent side, so. All right, here we go. Hit it for a harp. [01:08:03] Speaker D: Came and I was on my way when you and my let me. I too soon forgot that it was you that set me free. Yeah, you were here when I came. You'll be here when I'm gone. So don't be waiting for love. Cause I'll be waiting. [01:08:49] Speaker B: I can do without his. [01:08:50] Speaker D: Yeah. [01:08:51] Speaker B: I mean, he does that a lot. [01:08:53] Speaker C: Do you know what part bothered me, for one part about this, in this song? It's always bothered me, and I don't know why it's always bothered me. But the ramble on part, I don't. I don't know why. Yeah, I just hate that part. I hate that lyric. I don't know if it's the zeppelin thing. You know what I mean? Maybe because I'm thinking of Zeppelin when that. When he says the ramble on thing, and it just. I don't know. I always hated it every time it came out. Shit, that fucking line. And there's no reasoning behind it other than the Zeppelin connection. [01:09:28] Speaker B: Sometimes things. These bands did a lot of rambling, though, so. [01:09:33] Speaker C: Well, I mean, I kind of like the. I kind of like the actual progression and stuff. It's a little different. It's not typical. [01:09:39] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:09:40] Speaker C: So, I mean, that's one positive. [01:09:42] Speaker B: Yeah, it's not bad. I mean, it's definitely not bad. You know, the. It is a little bit different, obviously, than the straightforward stuff. [01:09:49] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:09:49] Speaker B: So I think he gets back a little bit too, like you said, some of the stuff that's going on on the first side where they keep it a little bit more interesting. But again, that. Yeah, yeah. That he does that. That I don't like. [01:10:00] Speaker C: Yeah, I never liked it. [01:10:01] Speaker D: Yeah. [01:10:02] Speaker B: Then he gets into that range, right? [01:10:04] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:10:04] Speaker B: I mean, you want to talk about the Mark Slaughter range? [01:10:07] Speaker C: Yeah, that's what it is, too. [01:10:08] Speaker B: That's. That's it. [01:10:09] Speaker C: Hmm. Yeah, I can. Yeah. Again, that doesn't bother you as much as a ramble on, but I don't like that much either, so it's. Yeah, yeah. Morning came and I was on my way when you reminded me I had too soon forgotten that it was you that set me free yeah, you were here when I came and you'll be here when I'm gone so don't be waiting for love cause I'll be waiting to ramble on. Headed for a heartbreak. Headed for a heartbreak, yeah. He does the ramble on again and it just drives me crazy. And again, I don't know why it's not my. I don't know. I just hated that from all the time. Wish you would have used a different lyric and made me feel better, but I kind of like the progression. It's a little different. Yeah, it's not typical. [01:10:56] Speaker B: I like the keyboard part. [01:10:58] Speaker C: Mm hmm. Yeah. All right, here we go. First two. [01:11:07] Speaker D: Tonight I won't be home you become a stranger I just got to be alone don't need nobody on my side I'm on. So don't be waiting for love? Cause I'll be waiting to ramble on? Heading for a heartbreak? Ready for a heartbreak? Heading for a heartbreak? It's no mistake, don't you think? I can feel the faith, I walk away, live again. [01:12:08] Speaker C: Um, so it's darling, don't wait up for me tonight, I won't be home? You've become a stranger? I just got to be alone? Don't need nobody on my side to dull the blade I'm on? So don't be waiting for love? Because I'll be waiting to ramble on. [01:12:27] Speaker B: There you go. [01:12:28] Speaker C: And. I don't know, I mean, there's that interesting line. Don't need nobody on my side to dole the blade I'm on. That's not bad. A little interesting. It's no mistake, don't you think? I can feel the pain, I walk away to live again. I never liked that line either. I don't know why. [01:12:50] Speaker B: I just assumed that they were breaking up. He was headed for the heartbreak. So I don't know if she's. [01:12:55] Speaker C: I don't know, maybe. [01:12:57] Speaker B: No, I'm saying that's what I thought it was, but it doesn't sound like a noun. Sounds like she is, I guess. [01:13:04] Speaker C: Well, I do know. I do know this solo is gonna be better. This is much more composed. I mean, there's some cool stuff that goes on here. All right, here we go. [01:13:17] Speaker D: Sadeena. [01:13:45] Speaker C: So we think of that. [01:13:46] Speaker B: Yeah, it was good. [01:13:47] Speaker C: I liked it. [01:13:48] Speaker B: Tapping a little beetle broader. I feel like I hear some of that in there. [01:13:56] Speaker C: Yeah, they had a similar type kind of tapping style. Very similar. It was very. It was very melodic and very compositional. So. No, I do like that a lot. I like the beginning part, actually, the best. Yeah, I thought that was good. And it was. That's the perfect length for that. So, for the song? [01:14:17] Speaker B: Yes, absolutely. [01:14:19] Speaker C: And the drums are pretty good in there, too, actually. We're going to back that up, and I'm going to play that back one more time because there's some interesting drum stuff that happens during that. So I'm going to play it one through one more time. Here we go. [01:15:01] Speaker D: Break. Don't make me I do any more heaven for our don't you think I feel the best? Sadeena, sadeena, sadeena. [01:17:23] Speaker B: How long is that song? [01:17:24] Speaker C: 512. [01:17:26] Speaker B: So I think that had he started soloing sooner, I would have liked that outro better, because I really like what he's doing on the guitar. I just felt like it took too long to get there. And then that little whatever the hell he did where it kind of sounded like he slowed down his voice. I was really weird. [01:17:48] Speaker C: I don't know, I kind of. I kind of like the ending. I think for this type of song. It was very weird to do that. Just that whole ending part to go a minute and a half, almost, of just instrumental. I'm assuming they didn't cut this down. I don't know if they did or nothing for the single. They don't say anything about this, so maybe they left it from whatever I remember it was always this long, so. [01:18:11] Speaker B: I don't remember hearing this song on the radio. [01:18:13] Speaker C: Me personally, maybe not. [01:18:15] Speaker B: I just remember it on MTV. I mean, obviously it was a hit, so I'm assuming it was. But like I said specifically, I don't remember this song on the radio, but I do remember it being on, like, MTV all the time. [01:18:28] Speaker C: No, well, listen, I mean, I enjoy. I enjoy this. This song personally. I enjoy guitar playing on it a lot. [01:18:38] Speaker B: Yeah, no, he does some really good. That's what I'm saying. Like, I think at the end, to me personally, it is cool. I like what they do. I just wish it started sooner, like, with him just soloing, as opposed to kind of having nothing going on. Why not just go to the solo? Because he's doing something. I mean, he's. To what he's doing in the solo, right? In the main solo. [01:18:57] Speaker C: Mm hmm. [01:18:58] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. [01:19:01] Speaker C: There's really good stuff in the drums. Has some really cool, cool parts at the end, too. [01:19:04] Speaker B: Yeah, kind of. This is a off time and those kind of weird stops and things like that. [01:19:08] Speaker C: Mm hmm. Well, this is. This is what I expect from. From the beginning. This is what I expect, right? Yeah, this is more good for good or worse. So I guess I'll go first. Um, I don't think the lyrics are bad. I'm gonna give a six musicianship if I just take it as guitar playing wise. It's probably one of my favorite things that he does. It's just. It's very him. So I'm gonna give it an eight on. On the music because I do like the music and production. I think the production is good. I mean, the drums are at least decently upfront and produced pretty decent. His vocals are good. I mean, you know, he does sometimes get into that mork slaughtery range, but I'm gonna say seven on production. The guitar. The guitar makes this song for me personally. And that. And the keyboard's not bad either. That little keyboard riff. I kind of like it. What do you think? [01:19:55] Speaker B: I mean, lyrics are not crazy, but. I don't know. I'm gonna say five because, again, I think it's a little generic, but music. Yeah, I'm gonna say a seven on the music. You know, even as this being the main ballad, it's. It's definitely unique and different from some of the other stuff that was going on. Yeah. Production. You gave it a seven. [01:20:20] Speaker C: Yeah, I gave it a seven. [01:20:21] Speaker B: You know, I'll throw a big bone to the production. I'll give it an eight on the production because I didn't give it to them. Music, I'll give it to. I think, um, you know, it was. It was recorded exactly the way it should have been. [01:20:35] Speaker C: Mm hmm. [01:20:36] Speaker B: So, yeah, so, five, seven. [01:20:40] Speaker C: Well, I gotta say that this is. I mean, this is not surprising. Out of all the albums we've done, this is very typical for what happens on the second side. Right. Especially during this time frame. It's just the second side generally never as good. Just generally what it is. It's very few albums we went through at the second side is as good as the first side. You know, we probably could count on two hands out of all the 40 something albums we've done that. You know what I mean? It's just. It is what it is. I mean, it's not. We're not making it. I mean, as far as we're concerned. Right. As far as our review concern, it's always the second side that was lacks, and. And maybe that's on purpose. Maybe that's the way the albums are sequenced. Right. And they're putting all the good stuff up front. Although, you know, if you were doing that, why wouldn't you stuck this on the first side? [01:21:25] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I. [01:21:27] Speaker C: This has more to do with the first. [01:21:30] Speaker B: I'm surprised, because, again, I mean, this is the valve. [01:21:34] Speaker C: Mm hmm. [01:21:35] Speaker B: This is the one. So again, maybe they just like, hey, we don't want to be like everybody else. We don't think we are like everybody else. [01:21:46] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, I think that, um, I'm glad we got this, because we were expecting. We wanted to have some kind of eighties hair metal, and we definitely got it because even though it's not. It's not the super typical, just because. Because there's some interesting things that they do that other bands don't do. Right. [01:22:01] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:22:02] Speaker C: But I'm glad we got this. It shows you. It shows you the state of what everything was at because, you know, lyric wise and theme wise, this is basically what was going on. It's just, you know, they had a little bit of a Prague thing happening at. Especially at the beginning and the last song. So it's just a little different than what the typical hair thing was doing. But, no, I got. I kind of like it. I mean, especially the first side is probably, you know, you could probably skip most of the second side if you want to think about it. [01:22:31] Speaker B: Was that the last song? [01:22:32] Speaker C: Yep. [01:22:33] Speaker B: Oh, I don't know, because I was looking up, I guess, where the lyrics are. There's two more songs. I don't know if those are, like, unreleased or whatever. Is there special edition? [01:22:41] Speaker C: I don't know. But in this one, this seems to be the original one. So this is how it ends. [01:22:45] Speaker B: Yeah, that's fine. I'm okay with stopping no matter what. [01:22:51] Speaker C: Alrighty. So why don't you watch you do your thing. [01:22:54] Speaker B: Yes. We are part of the Deep Dive podcast network again. Great bunch of guys took us in right away. If you want more individualized podcasts about your favorite bands, like Rush, Judas Priest, Uriah he, Tom Petty, Zeppelin, Queen, you name it, it's on there. Just check them out and give them a plug. And, Mark, where can they find us on the interwebs? [01:23:16] Speaker C: Rock with that pod, all the social media. Rock with that podcast.com. check out our Spotify list. Please give us a five star review on whatever platform that you listen to us on. You know, share us with other people if you like what we do. You never know what we're going to get. We can't tell you. The wheel spins its thing and then we're just. We're just. We're slaves to the wheel. The wheel does its thing and then we have to go and review it whether we like it or nothing. So there it is. Yeah. So next week we get to spin again and. Yeah, we're getting close to 100. Getting close to 100? [01:23:51] Speaker B: Yeah. What are we to wait three way. [01:23:55] Speaker C: One next nine, and then there will be 100. We'll see what kind of album we get. But who knows how that's gonna work out? Is 100 gonna be by itself or was 100 going to. If we happen to get a short album, maybe then we could do 100 by itself. [01:24:11] Speaker B: We don't get too many of those. [01:24:13] Speaker C: No, it happens once in a while. [01:24:15] Speaker B: Yeah. Or it's not too long. We just keep you up and we're like, oh, okay, we gotta stop. [01:24:19] Speaker C: Yeah, pretty much. All right, so we hope you enjoyed this review of winger. Winger from 1988. [01:24:26] Speaker B: Shout out to Stewart from Beavis and butter. [01:24:28] Speaker C: Yes. Wow. You know, it's kind of funny because they never. They never really, like, mentioned winger straight. Right. [01:24:34] Speaker B: I think they did the video. [01:24:36] Speaker C: Did they do the video? [01:24:37] Speaker B: I think they did. I was gonna wanna say yes. [01:24:39] Speaker C: I couldn't find it. [01:24:40] Speaker B: I thought. I thought maybe they had done something. Maybe I should know, too, because you know what the problem is, too, is that. So there they have them on streaming, but some of the. Some of them don't include the videos anymore. So it's only just the. The segments. [01:25:00] Speaker C: Gotcha. [01:25:02] Speaker B: So. [01:25:03] Speaker C: Yeah. I don't know. Well, I mean, they almost single handedly killed this band if they didn't do that. I know. I mean, at the time was still happening anyway, right? This was gonna happen no matter what. So it kind of is what it is anyway. [01:25:16] Speaker B: Maybe they didn't do it. [01:25:18] Speaker C: They made. I don't think so, from what I can gather. [01:25:20] Speaker B: Yeah, maybe not. [01:25:22] Speaker C: It was just him wearing the shirt. I think that's really what kinda did it anyway. Or if you want to interested, go look up Beavis and butthead. You'll find tons of stuff about Winger and Beavis and Butthead. So anyway, I guess we will see you next week. [01:25:33] Speaker B: Yeah. Chill. Chill. Later.